WHAT? An EXTREMELY Negative Wealthy Affiliate Review.
Hi Everyone,
I just was cruising through my Facebook timeline and an interesting paid ad showed up on it....The subject involved Wealthy Affiliate so of course I had to click to see what was the deal...
Here is the ad:
I went to the blog post this linked to and there was a VERY long review comparing the two programs.
An interesting read and I would be curious and interested in rebutting it's findings...
They mentioned the negative reviews that many WA members write about other programs and tools, disputed the #1 claim that WA holds with a huge number of niche members in the industry, then turned to statistics...
I used to hear a saying in the Army a lot "Statistics Lie and Liers Use Statistics," The statistics are many and bottom line they are claiming that when the number of members and websites are considered, their program amd members are more successful when it comes to top rated sites (traffic-wise)...
I think they may be comparing apples to oranges here...If you are interested in a competitor's take on Wealthy Affiliate, do a search on Google for this site...This is a 3 part series, a more detailed throw-down of Wealthy Affiliate I have never seen...
What do you think? We need some long-time and veteran members here to give us the low-down on this maybe? Information is power, and this must be rebutted? Also, having an answer for such claims would be helpful?
Add comments below please...
Cheers!
Dave : )
Recent Comments
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I have seen that review before, Dave, there is a bit of truth in it. Members do claim, we are an over 800.000 community of successful internet marketers. And we are definitely not. There are indeed 815,568 Friends/ members following Kyle. But the membership is for a lifetime. And the average of 1/8 is indeed filling in their profiles. But that's it. They do not even bother to start actually a website. So the successful rating is way below the 800.000 Due to the false claims our own members are making, you get reviews like this.
I do see what you are saying Loes, and thanks for chiming in....
So the data they are using is not accurate, and I am not totally clear on what the data set from their platform includes...but if one set or the other is off, it affects results....
It does bring up the fact that maybe a more accurate depiction of the platform would be to say that there are over 800,000 people that have joined, of which 60,000 are active and the remainder either free members or inactive (or whatever the case may be)...
We do not have access to the numbers, so this would only work if Kyle and Carson were to publish this data (which I doubt they want to do)...
It would provide a more accurate picture - but I do not see many sites/operations providing these numbers unless they are listed on one of the stock exchanges....
So I guess all we can do is state the obvious - compare the two and decide for yourself (I am not sure if they have a free option like WA does)...
This was a chance as I saw today, I have enough on my plate at the moment, I will leave this up to others that are focusing mainly on the MMO niche!
Appreciate your insight!
Cheers!
Dave : )
Hi Dave, (standing) my name is Brad and I am a former SBI/Site Build It member.
(serious face now) It was a few years back, so I am sure, like WA, much has changed and probably improved. At the time, I paid $299 per yer which included hosting - but only for maybe 2 or 3 sites max. That seems high, in retrospect because that was about 10 years ago. I am basically paying that annually now for WA and you can have host 25 sites! I cut my teeth on building websites with their block builder - nice for beginners but clunky, slow, and limited. As I became more adept at HTML, I began to upload pages I had created but that was a slow death - very time consuming. And, you had to correct and upload again for every little change. Again, I would guess they have progressed from that. One of my main beefs was I was trying to use DLGuard to deliver my curriculum downloads I write. Well, they didn't allow certain scripts to be run so I couldn't. They seemed to be somewhat of a conservative, plodding, dinosaur. When WordPress became "a thing" I was happy to move on.
SBI is a legit company, not a scam, but WA offers so much more - it isn't even close, especially as often as things are added and improved here. Honestly, I can spot an SBI site a mile away - there is something about the appearance that just isn't appealing.
My guess is that they are feeling some heat from WA and are becoming more aggressive. Case in point, just this year, after about ten years, I started receiving emails from "Ken" - do you think it was actually him... writing me???? :-) . They are reaching out to former members and trying to entice them to come back.
Overall, I had mild success with them but would never consider going back. Even more so, with the tactics Ken is using now to trash or discredit WA. He seemed classy at the time, but, again, if they indeed are feeling the heat....
I don't think WA has anything to worry about. Like with any product or membership they have users who are fiercely loyal to them and then others like me, couldn't wait to get out. Both companies can exist and both will have members who will benefit and be successful - why get nasty?
Wow Brad, thanks for your great insight on this platform! I had never heard of them before, so I guessed they were relatively small players (my bad - I do not know ALL the platforms that compete with WA)...
I am sure that they have progressed from your time with them, as all of us have, so as you say, the competition they are up against is moving them to a more aggressive stance with their marketing...
Certainly, it will cause a buzz...I would not use the negative approach either, as you say you would not...I learned a LONG time ago you can compare your x with someone else's x using points of difference as opposed to direct attacks...
When you do such negative marketing, it reflects on you oftentimes, and the opposite effect results - you lose the sale...I have seen people crash and burn doing this in the old offline sales days...
I really appreciate you taking the time to tell us about your experiences. I am wiser for it, and I am sure many others here are as well...
Cheers!
Dave : )
Hello Dave,
You are welcome, glad it could help. I totally agree with all points. It is always a wise decision to put time and energy into self -improvement vs. tearing someone else down - take the high road. In this specific case, they will need every bit of their focus and resources on innovation and improvements if they hope to stay on the same playing field as WA - that's a tall order. I would think it would have a reverse effect by calling attention to WA, if someone really does due diligence, I think they will discover that WA is the wise choice for the best value and chance for success.
Good point Brad...I think that this thread will provide lots of ammunition for the prospect who will have objections based on that 'study' the other guy has published...Cheers! Dave : )
I have not heard of that company. I haven't had time to check out his article.
Statistics can be very helpful if you know and understand what numbers you are looking at. It sounds like this guy has found a way to show some numbers that make the point that he wants to make. Without reading his review, I would suggest that if anyone reviews it, they will need to be able to Intelligently discuss the statistics.
I agree with comments below that many of the most successful WA member owned are hosted elsewhere for various reasons.
Many WA members are "guilty" of getting traffic to their websites by questioning if a business is scam or not. I suppose that marketing tactic works but it is one that I do not use. That is probably the single biggest negative of WA that I see.
If anyone does respond to his post, I would caution people to be very cautious about critizing his company if they have not tried his program personally. Stick with the facts of what you actually know.
I agree on the not bashing unless you have experience with the platform. I cannot say anything about how good or bad it may be....
What I can question is the protocol used to determine the stats he has come up with, This flew out at me almost immediately as I was reading his results and conclusions....
If you start with incomplete data, any tests and results will be skewed and flawed in all likelihood. That is where the argument that they are far superior falls apart for me,,,
On some points, he made some good arguments. Negative reviews posted by some do give us a bad name in some circles (I have a post on this as well)...
Thanks for stopping by and adding your input, it does help!
Cheers!
Dave : )
This is the battle of internet. Visitor will chose to read and believe what they chose to believe.
As for WA bootcamp also a way to do review and give negative review on other program. Some are not teaching affiliate marketing but make money online. We are also compare apple to orange.
I get used to it long ago. WA of course score 90 out of 100 for most of us and keep improving. You cant get weekly value webinar else where.
But like some members here been creating training for the sake of create. Some inserting affiliate link without WA blog post. I spotted but he is someone who is very senior down here.
So there always some things to look into it.
Lastly I happy to be here and have make over 5 figure worth affiliate commision over my learning and action taken
Yes, I guess it comes down to what the market will bear...I prefer to stay away from direct attacks by presenting points of difference in that I emphasize the features, tools, or advantages of what I am selling...
I am glad to hear of your success, best wishes for continued success!
Cheers!
Dave : )
SBI! is a direct competitor of WA. So I don't think it is an apples to oranges comparison.
I have used the analogy of the Pizza War between Pizza Hut and Papa John's because PH sued PJ over the "better ingredients, better pizza" slogan Papa John's uses. The implication being PJ's pizzas are superior to PH's pizzas.
The litigation and appeals went on for years.
And Papa John's is still using the slogan.
From a consumer viewpoint, it is a personal preference as to which pizza is better.
A take away from the pizza war is that marketers will be marketers and they can use the we are the best argument in their sales pitches without being libelous.
I appreciate your thoughts...With the 'apples to orange analogy', I was referring to the data set they used to compare the two using the tools mentioned in part 3 of their review.
Because we do not have accurate information on the number of sites that are hosted outside of the platforms, nor the number of websites that are NOT being used for monetization, the data that is being measured is questionable...
Does it really represent the audience/members activity? I do not think so....I, of course, do not have the exact numbers either, so I would not publish such a misleading review, nor use PPC to get traffic...
Since the method used is in question, the results are also open to question...As you say, this is an extremely debatable subject...
I also cannot say whether or not this is a viable platform at all, since I have never used it nor been a member....Reviews can bite you, and some people are writing reviews that really are not objective...
They can obscure this fact by throwing out numbers, but it really is the pot calling the kettle black. That is what I see reading between the lines of the reviews this guy has posted and is now advertising...
Interesting world...
Thanks for your input!
Dave : )
I have run into this review myself and I am outraged. I did some research on this SBI company and through further research found that 2 days ago, the founder of SBI, Ken envoy also went on a site called "Quora" to further discredit Wealthy Affiliate.
The past few days this guy has went to anyone who would listen to discredit WA. Through my research, I further found out that this SBI is slowly losing members. This man is looking to discredit WA to get Our members to come over to SBI in an attempt to salvage his company.
The truth will stand when the world is on fire!
SBI doesn't even come close to all we have here at WA.
I wouldn't worry about the phony reviews from SBI. I would just hide and watch. This company is slowly going down. It's like the saying goes "Give someone enough rope and they will hang themselves" that's what will happen here as well.
This was the first I had heard of the platform, so quite naturally when I saw the negative ad, was curious...
The deeper you look, the more it seems likely that they are feeling the heat of the big kid on the block, namely Wealthy Affiliate...
I cannot attest one way or the other as to the veracity of the platform or the training, nor to any results that others on that site may be getting since I am not a member...
It would be interesting to hear from former members who are now members of Wealthy Affiliate so we get a feel from the inside for what the platform is all about.
This post can then be referenced for answering objections for prospects that may be misled by the rhetoric from the other platform...
Good input, appreciated!
Dave : )
It made me curious as well. I haven't heard about this SBI until earlier as well. I have heard that they offer coaching for $69 to $99 an hour.
I guess WA is probably pretty intimidating to a small fry like Site Build It. If this founder Ken Envoy is giving WA such bad reviews, WA must be doing something right.
There are probably quite a few people that know this Ken Envoy is just a bunch of hot air!
I would love to hear what some of the ex- members of SBI have to say about WA.
People know the truth. This Ken Envoy is helping us get more members with his lies.
I think he may believe that what he has is better, and has the stats to prove it...Except the findings are suspect due to the procedure used, starting with the data set...
Hopefully, some former or current members of the other platform will chime in...I am sure they will have some great insight on all of this...
Cheers!
Dave : )
Dave,
According to their server they are in Quebec, so this is an East Coast Canadian company against the West Coast Canadian Company WA?
Dave, my 1st question would be are you a member of SiteSell?
If yes I understand the need to check out the competition, if NO then why are you not growing your business instead of looking at other opportunities?
I will say based on my experience that FB is full of "Ignorant Opinions" which is why the US hired Donald Trump to be their president quite sadly.
Which is why now I for the 1st time in my life as an honorably discharged veteran I can say I fear and am embarrassed by my own country.
Statistics are collections of factual information, people that manipulate them or politicize them to avoid the truth are the liars.
I have not checked out SiteSell myself other than to pop on to their home page.
The 1st thing I noticed is that they are not secure, they do not use HTTPS. I would hope they do for their sign up page at least.
I just earned my degree in Network Admin and IT Security perhaps you may see where I am going after the last huge older Windows OS Hack.
When a company has an insecure foundation it is hard to believe anything solid will ever stand?
By the way none of the links you tried to put up worked so I was not able to see the ad.
Thanks for bringing SiteSell to my attention I will investigate them a bit more thoroughly.
My best regards,
Gary
Hi, Gary....LOL no worries, I am busily working on the various tasks and projects in the works for sure!
As a member that is highly satisfied with WA, seeing this in my timeline was kind of a shock, and it did its job, in piquing my curiosity to the point of clicking through to the post...
By design I only added the image, I do not think that adding the actual link would be allowed (although maybe so?)...
I figured that the image and a search will get those that are interested in the review post....
Congrats on completing the degree, no doubt you will have business for the foreseeable future!
Agree also on the Orange comment, shaking my head daily from Dubai!
Good point on the secure aspect of the site....
Good input, helps us all!
Cheers!
Dave : )
Dave,
Thanks and I am happy you are a happy WA member as well! ;-}
I only mentioined the security deal because I plan on doing some penetration testing, part time along with my websites and these days well over 80% of all business are insecure.
WA had the foresight to be one of the 1st legitimate site building sites that has taken that into consideration.
In my mind that further sets them apart as the real leaders!
Great post, thanks for stirring the pot!!
Gary
I did the research and the truth is that many ex members of Site Build it left their program and they are now WA members. WA is WAY better than Solo. And there is a ton of success stories here at WA, literally every month. Some members share their success stories while others do not. Some Success Stories From 2017: Add Your Own!
I would like to hear from some of these former members...I believe the study was flawed from the start by the group selection criteria, in that they are not reflective of reality (see comments below)...
Yes, this seems more of a case where you overwhelm readers with data to make the real story harder to discern/decipher. Stats sound wonderful, they look good, and they impress...
Problem is that the old 'garbage in, garbage out' adage comes into play. Many will not use critical thinking, however, and will buy all the jargon and false stats that indicate...Nothing?
Thanks for your input/feedback!
Dave : )
"I think they may be comparing apples to oranges here" ... totally agree with you, Dave!
And Ken's "Final Results" might be full of flaws too.
You know why?
Because Ken's statistical analysis was based on name servers analysis ...
QUOTE
SBI!, like WA, has its own sitebuilder. Those who use it must host with us (Name Servers NS1.SITESELL.COM and NS2.SITESELL.COM). Wealthy Affiliate uses Name Servers NS1.MYWAHOSTING.COM and NS1.MYWAHOSTING.COM.
It’s possible to be a “customer” of both products without using the sitebuilders, but it’s sub-optimal. For the purposes of this discussion and the subsequent study, we define “paid customer” as someone who uses the product fully, including the builder.
UNQUOTE
Correct me if I am wrong, but there are so many top WA websites that are not using the name servers ns1.mywahosting.com and ns1.mywahosting.com. If this is true, then Ken's result is so inaccurate!
Yes, I would wager that many of the top earners here are in that situation. There are certain things that you will want to have more control over as you grow your business...
I am a case in point. We have 2 other hosts we work with and each has their good points for what we need them for (e-commerce).
On the other hand, I have some hosted here as well, and I also use some domains for building and testing and others that are in progress sites...Not intended to be monetized...
So the fallacy starts at the beginning with his decision on the groups to be compared, which are not reflective of the real picture for members using the two services, so all results that follow are questionable/invalid as well...
Good catch!
Dave : )
I know there are successful WA members with high income websites not hosted by WA. Whether they are sub-optimal for hosting elsewhere is irrelevant. The question should be how large is the universe of successful WA members hosting elsewhere. And whether the number is statistically significant or not. If the number is not significant, then you cannot say the results are inaccurate as determined by the methodology used.
Sidebar: A few years ago I spent almost two years on a process improvement project using Lean/Six Sigma methodology. Our testing/sampling size was too small. So we had to redo our sampling size.
"The question should be how large is the universe of successful WA members hosting elsewhere. And whether the number is statistically significant or not. If the number is not significant," ... nobody can provide the accurate numbers, and I believe neither Kyle and Carson. Once the successful WA members start hosting outside the WA system, they are out from the system. If I read SBI Study correctly (well I skimmed most time actually), Ken used the name servers ns1.mywahosting.com and ns1.mywahosting.com to do reverse analysis and wholly concluded the study based just on this. Well, perhaps I should rephrase "inaccurate" to ... their study is inconclusive in the absence of the statistically accurate population :)
Yes so many factors involved in studies, I have been involved in more than a few over the years, not in the IM field, however...The same principles hold...
Based on the methodology used, I would conclude the study is conclusive for WA members who host their websites on WA. But certainly not for ALL WA members.
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Thanks Dave .. I have written a Post on this after you but had not seen yours at the time. Below is mine .. and a great post from you.
Cheers, William. Attack on Wealthy Affiliates and the SiteSell Farce
Thanks, William, I had not seen this nor one more that Paul had posted...I was so surprised when this popped up on my timeline today, I just had to see what others thought....Cheers back! Dave : )